I believe that when somebody does not think before they speak or act can cause people to become hurt. As Jessica said 'We do not have to hurt someone purposly.' This is because they may already feel hurt by anothers words or actions. There is also the question which Paul raised 'is it a question of us hurting the ones that love us.' The people that love us the most our generally the people who are closest to us and mean a lot. I believe it is a lot easier to hurt the ones who are closest to us than complete strangers as the people closest know and understand us and therefore would feel more hurt. Lewis holt said 'it depends how you define the word love is it physically or emotionally' and this I think is true to believe because there are different ways in which people can think of love and hurt also you may not intentionly try to hurt somebody you love. Although is may happen becuase Vicky thought 'that people might take things the wrong way.'
I believe that we never purposley hurt those we love, because any decent person who really lvoed somebody would never want to hurt them. I also agree with the point 'We always hurt those who love us' that was made in one of the convosations between the Inner Circle. I agree with it because the people who love us care enough to be hurt by our actions and words, whereas someody who hated us would care alot less about what we do. Another point made by the Inner Circle was 'Mistakes lead to hurt' which follows on from my first point of we never mean to hurt people we love. And also the point of trust is important, that hurting somebody who has put alot of trust into you is going to hurt them alot more, because trust is something that is earnt and not simply given.
on a wednesday afternoon, a group of students with thier teacher sat in a class room eith a slight bit of sun peeking through the window pane of the door. As the class settled down the first motion was arised;
Paul said 'Do we always hurt the ones we love?' also he said the fact that we love them means we hurt them. As a few mumbled words passed between seun,jess and lewis and paul, seun then said cthe love we have can influence are decsions, then jess jumped as said we do not have to hurt someone we love purposly. the over all idea the students got from hurting the people they love is that hurting can come in many different ways physical and mental.
these are some of the phrases i was able to pick from the discussion
Seun: it is part of being human to hurt the ones we love
Jess: it could be the best choice or option for you but your family might feel hurt
Paul: in life we make mistakes without knowing
Seun: Level of trust shatters when you think the person loves you.
Lewis: not everyone is happy.
Bianca: we accidentally hurt the other person without knowing. For example when i wake up on the wrong side of the bed and then my mum greets me and i don't respond just because i am in my mood doesn't mean i don't love her.
Leo : but we scar them in the long term.
Matina: the previous group mentions that we intentionally hurt the ones that we love but all the other groups mentioned different types of ways to hurt the ones we love
* some of the words may have not been the excact words spoken.
As nineteen of us all gathered together in our own version of a symposium we discussed each person’s hypothesis on the question at hand. With a square table of four chairs placed inside an outer square of tables, the discussion of our matter took place with four of our nineteen students going to sit in the middle. On this Wednesday afternoon we were all greeted with the statement “this house believes we hurt the ones we love” and to which we had our own opinions. However an opening response to this statement set us on our journey to find a conclusion. “it is inevitable, it is part of being a person” – was Seun’s response and to this I do agree! Don’t we all? It is virtually impossible for a single person to live their own lives without unintentionally hurting another. But is it that we hurt the ones we love? “we always hurt the ones who love us” Pauls quick analysis turned the tables, as we all began to think about this we realised he was right, there was a lot of sense in what he said. To which there was yet another quick response by Jessica “we don’t hurt them to intentionally hurt them” and we don’t, we don’t set out to deliberately hurt a person, we can hurt one person by going to help another, and this follows the pattern of karma, the people we hurt are hurt because as Vickie said “they care enough to be hurt” this is true but that does not mean the people we hurt don’t themselves hurt other people.
The tok class were sat in their inner and outer circles, ready to discuss today's topic in the style of a symposium (unfortunately without alcohol). In the inner circle was Bianca, Steven, Seun and the extremely handsome Paul. Seun opened the conversation. "I think personally, we hurt the ones love because of our close relationships with them. If it is romantic love, you can spend so much time together that your negative traits begin to show and you argue a lot more."
He looked to me, and I carried on... "I think it would be better to say that we hurt the ones who love is, rather than who we love."
Bianca went on to say... "If we wake up in a bad mood and are not particularly nice to people and hurt them, they are also likely to carry that bad mood on to others in their lives and hurt them intentionally also."
Ste added... "Even though we hurt the ones we love, it is never intentional."
The group carried on from point to point generally agreeing that love is a tender issue, and although as people, we all make mistakes and hurt eachother, it is never intentional and it can be forgiven and forgotten.
As the year 12 students of epistemology sat down to discuss the motion '' You hurt the ones you love ''.There were several questions about the wording of the motion and most people ended up redefining the motion. Paul : '' We are hurt by the ones we love''.He then went on to explain that we feel hurt by people whose actions aren't expected, and its because we don't expect certain behaviours from the ones we love we end up getting deeply hurt. Seun also touched on the levels of trust amongst loved ones. This he believed was a factor that contributed to ways in which we hurt other people. Sammie : '' mutual bond'' ,she questioned the category in which loved ones fell,she established that closeness and acts of kindness from people can potentially place them in the ''loved ones'' group. Jade also strongly agreed with Paul saying '' You hurt the people who love you rather than you being hurt by the people who love you ''.This she proofed by questioning the extent to which we are aware of the ones who love us. Vickie also made mention of the fact that '' You hurt the ones who care enough to be hurt ''. But in all the whole room discussed the motion using different approaches and sectors of love ranging from motherly love to mutual love amongst friends or neighbours, and arrived at an almost similar point of view
Love and hurt are two subjects that SEEM so far apart, yet, tragically a lot of the time they come hand in hand. Hurting the ones we love appears to be a frequent occurrence which affects us all, it is therefore a highly discussed topic, from the memos of ancient scholars such as Socrates to hit singles such as Bleeding love by Leona Lewis, and the topic found its way to a small TOK class, on a relaxed Wednesday afternoon, after the masses of chaotic school children had fled the school, leaving a tranquil silence that fashioned an excellent ambience perfect for discussing such tender matters. Gathered around a diminutive table of four that was representative of “inner circles” in Socratic dialogues, four knowledgeable adolescents discussed the delicate matter of love, and hurt. I took it upon myself to open the dialogue with a simple ideology; I presented the idea that we hurt the ones love due to our close relationships with them. Take the example of two people in love, after a while their budding love soon dulls as they spend more time with one another. It seems there is a correlation between spending time with people and our likeability to hurt them. Our negative traits and habits begin to surface and a lot more hurt is dealt. My Good friend Paul sustained the conversation with his straightforward declaration "I think it would be better to say that we hurt the ones who love is, rather than who we love." There was a universal concurrence with this statement Many beliefs and dogmas were raised soon after; the occasional anecdote was woven into the discussions and perhaps the most memorable was that of Bianca who often acquaints with amusing stories, she told us about particular mornings when she wakes with not so friendly dispositions, and how she felt that she then conveys this dispositions to those close to her such as her mother, who may react to her foul mood by gaining one herself. That afternoon held one of those rare discussions where honest and intellectual conversation allowed genuine concise statement s to be created, and I think us, a group of adolescents, would have made Socrates proud.
sean: your always going to have negative quality's"
this made me think that he is not a particularly positive person to be saying such a thing like that. it could be interpreted in many different ways depending on the type of person you are, but i interpreted it that its right because no one is perfect, and your not human with out having this negativity about you which occurs in everyone.
this in on behalf of lewis neill because he could not get onto to blogger.
it was dull but sunny wednesday. the clouds covered the skies and the mood was low has we had just finished a long school day. the group came up with the question ' do we always hurt the ones we love'. lewis, paul, jess and seun entered the cicle to start the discusion. seun was the first person to talk suggesting that ' yes we do hurt the ones we love but always. different people see things in different ways' this started the dicusion off and then a few seconds later was followed up by paul suggesting ; yes i agree but we always seem to hurt the ones that love us' everyone agreed on pauls suggestion. the discussion then carried on with...
i posted this on behalf of PAMELA she forgot her pass word.
it was a great and wonderful day, we all sat down in our tok class with our teacher and some student in the middle circle to discuss the topic at hand "this house believe we always hurt the ones we love". we do not always hurt the people we love , but sometimes we do without knowing it. to refer to some of the important point discussed that are relevant to the issue at hand.
Paul: sometimes but not always.
jess:made another point that is important saying, no matter how you do things or how you approach them, it will always go round to hurt them and even if you do not have the intention of doing it, it still hurt them in some certain way.
ste: doing something with no intention
Andy: trust in someone tht tends to hurt you later and a bond with someone
Sammy:trying to help them but the way they interpret the helping and the way you approach them.
lewis: emotionally and different ways of hurting people.
leo: separating people and talking to some more than others also hurt the ones we love. and also making a joke when it is not needed.
bianca: when not in the mood, we hurt the ones we love.
Vicky: we hurt the people who are close and who care enough to be hurt.
We had a group discussion based on the topic of Socrates and his 'Socratic Dialogue' and we had discussed the topic of 'We always hurt the ones we love'. This is true for most cases however, if you say some kind of excuse that doesn't sound reasonable then that could make the person/people you were talking to misinterpret the reason and hence cause them to be hurt as they may think you are hiding the truth to them. As I have said in the group discussion that I was involved in, sometimes a joke that may seem hilarious to yourself, Make sure that it is at an appropriate time unlike a comedian who i had once seen beforehand. This comedian had made a ventriloquist joke at his wife's dad's funeral saying 'Let me out, I'm in a box!!' of course I had no doubt that his wife left him after that. As Bianca had said; "If we wake up in a bad mood and are not particularly nice to people and hurt them, they are also likely to carry that bad mood on to others in their lives and hurt them intentionally also."
this made me think that he is not a particularly positive person to be saying such a thing like that.
Although I am not taking it as such Lewis, I felt that comment was quite personal and delivered in a tactless and hurtful manner, I can see that you agree with me after making this comment, but before this and even considering this, I am slightly hurt that you felt it necessary to say this, it added nothing to your comment and i do not think it was needed.
I believe that when somebody does not think before they speak or act can cause people to become hurt. As Jessica said 'We do not have to hurt someone purposly.' This is because they may already feel hurt by anothers words or actions. There is also the question which Paul raised 'is it a question of us hurting the ones that love us.' The people that love us the most our generally the people who are closest to us and mean a lot. I believe it is a lot easier to hurt the ones who are closest to us than complete strangers as the people closest know and understand us and therefore would feel more hurt. Lewis holt said 'it depends how you define the word love is it physically or emotionally' and this I think is true to believe because there are different ways in which people can think of love and hurt also you may not intentionly try to hurt somebody you love. Although is may happen becuase Vicky thought 'that people might take things the wrong way.'
ReplyDeleteI believe that we never purposley hurt those we love, because any decent person who really lvoed somebody would never want to hurt them. I also agree with the point 'We always hurt those who love us' that was made in one of the convosations between the Inner Circle. I agree with it because the people who love us care enough to be hurt by our actions and words, whereas someody who hated us would care alot less about what we do. Another point made by the Inner Circle was 'Mistakes lead to hurt' which follows on from my first point of we never mean to hurt people we love. And also the point of trust is important, that hurting somebody who has put alot of trust into you is going to hurt them alot more, because trust is something that is earnt and not simply given.
ReplyDeleteNote: these are not the exact words that these people may have said
ReplyDeleteJess: Hurt is inevitable.
Bianca: Hurt can be off the simplest of things.
Lewis: Yeah, but hurt can be either physical or emotional.
Bianca: Time can cause hurt, by not spending time with some people they may feel neglected, we are then unintentionally hurting them.
Me: So can we say that hurt for some people can be described as second nature?
Leo: I think so because even a joke that you may find funny could really hurt someone emotionally.
Seun: It seems like the more you see someone the more likely you are to argue with them, which can then cause you to hurt the ones you love.
Vickie: We can also misinterpret each other's true intentions, this can also cause hurt.
Me: I find that this house does believe that we do hurt the ones we love.
on a wednesday afternoon, a group of students with thier teacher sat in a class room eith a slight bit of sun peeking through the window pane of the door. As the class settled down the first motion was arised;
ReplyDeletePaul said 'Do we always hurt the ones we love?' also he said the fact that we love them means we hurt them. As a few mumbled words passed between seun,jess and lewis and paul, seun then said cthe love we have can influence are decsions, then jess jumped as said we do not have to hurt someone we love purposly. the over all idea the students got from hurting the people they love is that hurting can come in many different ways physical and mental.
these are some of the phrases i was able to pick from the discussion
ReplyDeleteSeun: it is part of being human to hurt the ones we love
Jess: it could be the best choice or option for you but your family might feel hurt
Paul: in life we make mistakes without knowing
Seun: Level of trust shatters when you think the person loves you.
Lewis: not everyone is happy.
Bianca: we accidentally hurt the other person without knowing. For example when i wake up on the wrong side of the bed and then my mum greets me and i don't respond just because i am in my mood doesn't mean i don't love her.
Leo : but we scar them in the long term.
Matina: the previous group mentions that we intentionally hurt the ones that we love but all the other groups mentioned different types of ways to hurt the ones we love
* some of the words may have not been the excact words spoken.
As nineteen of us all gathered together in our own version of a symposium we discussed each person’s hypothesis on the question at hand. With a square table of four chairs placed inside an outer square of tables, the discussion of our matter took place with four of our nineteen students going to sit in the middle. On this Wednesday afternoon we were all greeted with the statement “this house believes we hurt the ones we love” and to which we had our own opinions. However an opening response to this statement set us on our journey to find a conclusion. “it is inevitable, it is part of being a person” – was Seun’s response and to this I do agree! Don’t we all? It is virtually impossible for a single person to live their own lives without unintentionally hurting another. But is it that we hurt the ones we love? “we always hurt the ones who love us” Pauls quick analysis turned the tables, as we all began to think about this we realised he was right, there was a lot of sense in what he said. To which there was yet another quick response by Jessica “we don’t hurt them to intentionally hurt them” and we don’t, we don’t set out to deliberately hurt a person, we can hurt one person by going to help another, and this follows the pattern of karma, the people we hurt are hurt because as Vickie said “they care enough to be hurt” this is true but that does not mean the people we hurt don’t themselves hurt other people.
ReplyDeleteThe tok class were sat in their inner and outer circles, ready to discuss today's topic in the style of a symposium (unfortunately without alcohol).
ReplyDeleteIn the inner circle was Bianca, Steven, Seun and the extremely handsome Paul. Seun opened the conversation.
"I think personally, we hurt the ones love because of our close relationships with them. If it is romantic love, you can spend so much time together that your negative traits begin to show and you argue a lot more."
He looked to me, and I carried on...
"I think it would be better to say that we hurt the ones who love is, rather than who we love."
Bianca went on to say...
"If we wake up in a bad mood and are not particularly nice to people and hurt them, they are also likely to carry that bad mood on to others in their lives and hurt them intentionally also."
Ste added...
"Even though we hurt the ones we love, it is never intentional."
The group carried on from point to point generally agreeing that love is a tender issue, and although as people, we all make mistakes and hurt eachother, it is never intentional and it can be forgiven and forgotten.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteAs the year 12 students of epistemology sat down to discuss the motion '' You hurt the ones you love ''.There were several questions about the wording of the motion and most people ended up redefining the motion.
ReplyDeletePaul : '' We are hurt by the ones we love''.He then went on to explain that we feel hurt by people whose actions aren't expected, and its because we don't expect certain behaviours from the ones we love we end up getting deeply hurt. Seun also touched on the levels of trust amongst loved ones. This he believed was a factor that contributed to ways in which we hurt other people.
Sammie : '' mutual bond'' ,she questioned the category in which loved ones fell,she established that closeness and acts of kindness from people can potentially place them in the ''loved ones'' group.
Jade also strongly agreed with Paul saying '' You hurt the people who love you rather than you being hurt by the people who love you ''.This she proofed by questioning the extent to which we are aware of the ones who love us. Vickie also made mention of the fact that '' You hurt the ones who care enough to be hurt ''. But in all the whole room discussed the motion using different approaches and sectors of love ranging from motherly love to mutual love amongst friends or neighbours, and arrived at an almost similar point of view
Love and hurt are two subjects that SEEM so far apart, yet, tragically a lot of the time they come hand in hand. Hurting the ones we love appears to be a frequent occurrence which affects us all, it is therefore a highly discussed topic, from the memos of ancient scholars such as Socrates to hit singles such as Bleeding love by Leona Lewis, and the topic found its way to a small TOK class, on a relaxed Wednesday afternoon, after the masses of chaotic school children had fled the school, leaving a tranquil silence that fashioned an excellent ambience perfect for discussing such tender matters. Gathered around a diminutive table of four that was representative of “inner circles” in Socratic dialogues, four knowledgeable adolescents discussed the delicate matter of love, and hurt.
ReplyDeleteI took it upon myself to open the dialogue with a simple ideology; I presented the idea that we hurt the ones love due to our close relationships with them. Take the example of two people in love, after a while their budding love soon dulls as they spend more time with one another. It seems there is a correlation between spending time with people and our likeability to hurt them. Our negative traits and habits begin to surface and a lot more hurt is dealt.
My Good friend Paul sustained the conversation with his straightforward declaration "I think it would be better to say that we hurt the ones who love is, rather than who we love." There was a universal concurrence with this statement
Many beliefs and dogmas were raised soon after; the occasional anecdote was woven into the discussions and perhaps the most memorable was that of Bianca who often acquaints with amusing stories, she told us about particular mornings when she wakes with not so friendly dispositions, and how she felt that she then conveys this dispositions to those close to her such as her mother, who may react to her foul mood by gaining one herself.
That afternoon held one of those rare discussions where honest and intellectual conversation allowed genuine concise statement s to be created, and I think us, a group of adolescents, would have made Socrates proud.
erm, yeah here's what i wrote,
ReplyDeletesean: your always going to have negative quality's"
this made me think that he is not a particularly positive person to be saying such a thing like that. it could be interpreted in many different ways depending on the type of person you are, but i interpreted it that its right because no one is perfect, and your not human with out having this negativity about you which occurs in everyone.
and thats all i done
this in on behalf of lewis neill because he could not get onto to blogger.
ReplyDeleteit was dull but sunny wednesday. the clouds covered the skies and the mood was low has we had just finished a long school day. the group came up with the question ' do we always hurt the ones we love'. lewis, paul, jess and seun entered the cicle to start the discusion. seun was the first person to talk suggesting that ' yes we do hurt the ones we love but always. different people see things in different ways' this started the dicusion off and then a few seconds later was followed up by paul suggesting ; yes i agree but we always seem to hurt the ones that love us' everyone agreed on pauls suggestion. the discussion then carried on with...
i posted this on behalf of PAMELA she forgot her pass word.
ReplyDeleteit was a great and wonderful day, we all sat down in our tok class with our teacher and some student in the middle circle to discuss the topic at hand "this house believe we always hurt the ones we love". we do not always hurt the people we love , but sometimes we do without knowing it. to refer to some of the important point discussed that are relevant to the issue at hand.
Paul: sometimes but not always.
jess:made another point that is important saying, no matter how you do things or how you approach them, it will always go round to hurt them and even if you do not have the intention of doing it, it still hurt them in some certain way.
ste: doing something with no intention
Andy: trust in someone tht tends to hurt you later and a bond with someone
Sammy:trying to help them but the way they interpret the helping and the way you approach them.
lewis: emotionally and different ways of hurting people.
leo: separating people and talking to some more than others also hurt the ones we love. and also making a joke when it is not needed.
bianca: when not in the mood, we hurt the ones we love.
Vicky: we hurt the people who are close and who care enough to be hurt.
We had a group discussion based on the topic of Socrates and his 'Socratic Dialogue' and we had discussed the topic of 'We always hurt the ones we love'. This is true for most cases however, if you say some kind of excuse that doesn't sound reasonable then that could make the person/people you were talking to misinterpret the reason and hence cause them to be hurt as they may think you are hiding the truth to them.
ReplyDeleteAs I have said in the group discussion that I was involved in, sometimes a joke that may seem hilarious to yourself, Make sure that it is at an appropriate time unlike a comedian who i had once seen beforehand. This comedian had made a ventriloquist joke at his wife's dad's funeral saying 'Let me out, I'm in a box!!' of course I had no doubt that his wife left him after that.
As Bianca had said; "If we wake up in a bad mood and are not particularly nice to people and hurt them, they are also likely to carry that bad mood on to others in their lives and hurt them intentionally also."
this made me think that he is not a particularly positive person to be saying such a thing like that.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I am not taking it as such Lewis, I felt that comment was quite personal and delivered in a tactless and hurtful manner, I can see that you agree with me after making this comment, but before this and even considering this, I am slightly hurt that you felt it necessary to say this, it added nothing to your comment and i do not think it was needed.
i thought Socratic dialogues where boring at first, i didn't know anyone who knew anything about Socrates, but Jay-z quotes him on his new album.
ReplyDelete"Pious pious cause God loves pious?
Socrates asks, “Whose bias do y’all seek?”
All for Plato, screech"
Was proud to know what he was talking about.